6 Big Time Swimming Tips for Triathletes

TriDot Podcast Episode 288

6 Big Time Swimming Tips for Triathletes

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Announcer: This is the TriDot Podcast. TriDot uses your training data and genetic profile combined with predictive analytics and artificial intelligence to optimize your training, giving you better results in less time with fewer injuries. Our Podcast is here to educate, inspire and entertain. We'll talk all things triathlon with expert coaches and special guests. Join the conversation and let's improve together. Together.

Warm Up

Vanessa Ronksley: It is a great day for a podcast everybody and we are bringing you the final installment of a three part series that we've been working on. Not sure if you've noticed, but we've had six big time tips for triathletes in the run the bike and now we're finally going to finish it off with the swim tips. And we have two amazing coaches with us here. One of them whom is the brains behind the tips. This week we have IRONMAN World Champion, Olympic medalist, IRONMAN U Master coach and head coach of Giddy Up racing, Michellie Jones. We also have a second swim expert who is none other than Brandy Ramirez. She is the director of TriDot Pool School, She's IRONMAN Youth certified coach and the founder of She Strong Incorporated. Welcome to the Podcast, Michellie and Brandy.

Brandy Ramirez: Thank you, thanks for having us.

Vanessa Ronksley: And I'm your host today. Vanessa Ronksley, your average triathlete with elite level enthusiasm. I am excited to knock these tips out today and hopefully they will bring your swim to the next level. And I've had a chance to preview these tips that our coaches have provided to us and I am actually looking forward to getting into the pool and trying them out. We are going to get going here on six big time swimming tips for triathletes.

Announcer: Time to warm up, let's get moving.

Vanessa Ronksley: We are currently recording this in three different time zones in three different countries and I know there's a lot of worldly experience here. So what I want to know where is the coolest place you have ever swam? And it can be either in training or racing. Michellie, you are the furthest off in a wonderful land. So why don't you kick us off today?

Michellie Jones: Oh my goodness, there's so many to pick from. I've swam like everything. I swam like in every different continent. I think one of my favorites besides Kona because you know, every year I will swim every single day I'm on the island. So besides Kona, I did do a race in Tahiti off one of the islands called Moorea and it was absolutely like the beautifulest water that you ever possibly can see. But Australia has so many wonderful beaches. It's Also hard not to pass up every single beach in Australia.

Vanessa Ronksley: I can totally concur with you on Australia swimming. There's nothing like it. The water all warm. Well, for most of the year anyways. And, yeah, it's just stunning scenery. To your. To your left and to your right. Brandy, how about you?

Brandy Ramirez: Well, I was in New Zealand for world championships, and while I didn't get a swim because my wetsuit turned out not to be in our vehicle, I did get into the water, but it was extremely cold. I would agree with Michellie. Every time I go to Hawaii, every time I go to Kona, I either go surfing or I go for a swimming. It's beyond beautiful. And when you get to see all the fish, it's just. It's. Yeah, it's so amazing.

Michellie Jones: Although, Brandy, I did. I also love Nice this year. Like, the Med. I love the Med. So, I mean, there's so many awesome swim venues. It's. As I said, it's tough to pick one. I've picked so many now.

Brandy Ramirez: Right.

Vanessa Ronksley: I. I hear you about that Mediterranean Sea. I've never seen anything so blue. It was such this deep blue, and it was so deep, and you could see so far down. That was quite incredible. That one was not on the top of my list, which is surprising to me. But again, this was a really fun question to think about and made me super grateful for all of the experiences I've had in so many different pockets of the world. And as I was thinking, so many of the stories kind of fell into the type 2 fun category. Like, they're not really fun, but then when you look back at it, you're like, oh, yeah, was actually fun. So I'm. I'm taking us way back. This is, like, blast from the past. PJ and I, when we were on our extended honeymoon in Australia, we were staying with one of his childhood friends who has an extremely adventurous spirit, and he took us on a bushwalk. And I'm keeping the location a secret for a number of reasons, but we were in Queensland, and we came to this one spot with this waterfall. And this has nothing to do with, like, training or racing, but I couldn't skip over this story. So we. He. Our. Our friend literally walked to the edge of this waterfall, and he just jumped right into this massive, cool, deep, small pool, and it was connected to a really deep creek. And. And then there was a canyon that was on both sides. And so my husband went next. He just jumped in too. And I was like, this is out of my wheelhouse. I know, I don't want to jump into anything that I'm not sure what is at the bottom. But it took me a while, like longer than I'd like to admit. But I actually got the courage to jump in and it was freezing cold and it was exhilarating and we actually ended up having to swim down that creek to be able to get out of the water. And so I think that that is probably one of the most memorable swims that I've ever had and probably one of the most adventurous things I've ever done up to that point anyways. And I don't know, maybe it was part of training. It built up my mental fortitude a little bit. So that's, that's where I'm going with, with the swim somewhere in the world. And I, I'd like to throw this out to our community. So make sure that you're part of the community hub or you can even find us on Instagram. And I want you to tell us where is the coolest place that you have ever swam. It could be for training, racing, or you can just follow, follow my lead and not have anything to do with training or racing. But I can't wait to hear what you have to say.

Announcer: On to the main set going in 3, 2, 1.

Main Set

Vanessa Ronksley: We specifically want our six big tips to be things our listeners can apply to their training the very next time that they hop in the pool. But Brandy, try pool school. We can't do a swim Podcast without mentioning tri pool school because it is so effective at helping athletes with their swim. We, we could easily be done this Podcast in about 10 seconds with the simple words here. Tip number one, go to pool school. That's it. The end. Cool down. Just kidding. But. But I'm just kidding. Yeah. So I promise we will get to our six big time swim tips in a minute here. But first, Brandy, can you kick us off with a tiny little overview of what TriDot pool school looks like from an athlete's perspective?

Brandy Ramirez: Yes, absolutely. So we created TriDot Pool school because we want to focus on bridging that gap and getting the fear of swim and out of people's minds as well as making you the most efficient in the water as humanly possible. So we're going to focus on a ground up approach. We're going to start from the bottom. We're going to build you from there. We've had a huge success. Over a thousand athletes have come through it with a 13% time drop as well as dropping strokes. So we want you to walk away from pool school. Feeling confident, knowing that you could do it, but being more efficient and then just constantly taking the homework, building and building, practicing, getting faster every single time you hit the water.

Vanessa Ronksley: Yes.

Michellie Jones: Yeah.

Vanessa Ronksley: I do have to say that everything that you've mentioned there, it tracks. I have been an athlete in the water and just the amount of strokes that you drop and how smooth you feel in the water after learning through this technique in a very short period of time. We're talking like very few hours in the pool here that don't even make you tired, to be honest. It's mind blowing. It just like literally blows your mind how effective this teaching method is. Michellie, you've been a coach on deck for pool school and many of your athletes have gone through it as well. So what difference has it made for the athletes that you work with?

Michellie Jones: Well, actually not only have I been a coach on deck, but I've actually been a student as well. I really believe in like embracing yourself in the whole philosophy as an athlete and as a coach. So I think that was really beneficial. But I think what pool school does, it gives those athletes an opportunity to identify what they can improve based on their functional freestyle. And it gives you homework before, it gives you homework during, and then it gives you homework after. And it just makes it's adults and I think that's the biggest thing that people forget as adults. We learn to swim very differently than a kid that's like that has no fear, that is so flexible. So I think that's, that's the bottom line. This functional freestyle that tri duck pool school offers, it's an opportunity for adults to learn how to swim. And it's basically from kindergarten all the way until you graduate. And I think, and that's the process of learning swimming every. Anyway, you know, if you don't have the fundamentals, then you're not going to have the efficiency. So try to pool schools developing those fundamentals, then you can make them more efficient based on your functional freestyle. Because I have limitations in my mobility and I think once we identify and understand what we're doing not well and then you get corrected and then you can then see what you're not doing well. I think that's the biggest learning curve. If you don't know what you're doing incorrectly, how are you ever going to learn? And I think that's the nice thing with that amount of time that you get at pool school, it's the perfect amount of time to identify, give you homework, to go back and fix whatever those issues are and then that confidence that you get because at the end of that pool school, you were going to be swimming faster than you ever have. And it's such a good confidence booster.

Vanessa Ronksley: So I think the question is, Michellie, since you've been a student of pool school, how many seconds did you drop off your 100 meter time?

Michellie Jones: Not as many as I should have, but now I have. You know, it's funny, it's like I think I was like maybe three or four seconds, but now I feel like I've gotten more efficient. Just those good reminders that like every day. And we'll talk about this as we go through some of those tips every day, I will use something that I've learned at pool school to make my efficiency and actually just make me feel better in the water.

Vanessa Ronksley: Let's dive into our first big time swim tip for triathletes. Michele, we're going to start with you. Can you tell us what swim tip number one is?

Michellie Jones: And I think this is the biggest hurdle for most triathletes because we just want to get in and swim, swim, swim. And I'm like, I don't care how fit you are, it's like you're not going to get better at swimming if you don't have good technique and you don't know what you're doing incorrectly. You know, dragging your legs, crossing over on each stroke, you know you're working twice as hard. You know, body position is so key. So you've got to start with the basic fundamentals and that's like good body position. And then of course, your stroke mechanics. And I think video analysis is really, really good because you can film yourself every day.

And as long as you know what you are doing incorrectly, it's such a great tool that you can use personally. And then you can also get feedback from your coach. And I think one of the things that I love doing when I get an athlete to send me video, if I am not seeing them on deck and you know, telling them straight away, I'm like, well, what do you think you're doing? Well, that's what I always ask first because I think that's a real confidence booster that you want them to know what they're doing well. And then I ask them, okay, what do you see that you need to improve on? And a lot of times, you know, they get this aha moment. So I didn't know I was crossing over, you know, so it's like really, that video analysis, it's making sure that you are working on technique.

Like, as I said earlier, when my swimming is not going how I want it to feel, I will go back to a drill that gave me the biggest bang for the buck at pool school. For me, that is six, one, six, or six beat, switch, kick. It's sometimes nine. Every time I fall apart, I go back to that pacific drill, and I feel so much better after doing it.

Vanessa Ronksley: I think that is so key. And one of the things that pool school does really well, actually, is it identifies the areas that each specific swimmer needs to focus on. And because you're getting that constant feedback, um, you know, specifically what drill is the one that you need to work on. And I. And for me, I remember it's the fingertip drag drill. Like, I. I go back to that one every single day in the pool. And. And as you said, Michellie, like, if. If things are feeling off, it's like, okay, reset. I just need to do my fingertip drag drill. And then it's emphasizing the high elbows and all of those sorts of things. So I agree with you on that. And. And technique is, you know, the basis of why swimmers are capable of or why good swimmers are good swimmers is because of their technique that they've most likely learned from the time they were a kid all the way up until to an adult. Brandy, do you have anything to add here on tip number one, which is working on your technique and stroke first, and then the fitness will come later?

Brandy Ramirez: Yeah, absolutely. So your head and your body position is absolutely key. The. We like to tell people statistics, because sometimes that really helps to sink in with some people who are a little bit more analytic. But for.

Vanessa Ronksley: I love statistics. Throw it out there, Brandy.

Brandy Ramirez: For every one inch that your head is too high, your trunk, as in your legs and your hips, they will sink by 3 inches. So just imagine how much drag you're creating with your lower body by having your head just slightly too high. So head and body position are key. You want that body to be gliding across the top of the water. And like Michellie said, if you think you're gliding across the top of the water, which a lot of us, we think we're doing perfect, right? That video analysis is so important because you can actually see where the flaw is in your body position. Your coach can find it, you guys can review it. And sometimes, I mean, if you. If you look at learning, we're either video or audio learners. That's the way most people are. And so if you can hear something that clicks in your head that makes you think of the correct Body position, or you could see where you need to correct it. Those two things are going to be key in helping you get that perfect body position in the water. So you're gliding across the top of it. The other thing. And I have this as well, because Michellie right. As we get older, our body changes, and so we start making compositions or we start compromising our good form to protect those injuries, right? So for me, like, I went through breast cancer, and I had a bilateral mastectomy. For me, I didn't want to pull with my lat because that was engaging my pecs, and it was very painful. And so in the beginning, I created a composition where I was dropping my elbow and I was pulling into my center median. I did this subconsciously to not engage my lat, right? To protect my injury. So when I went to pool school, because I was also an athlete in the water, every coach who has been on deck has been in the water, so we know what every athlete goes through. But I had to remind myself to paddle wide. So I'm a surfer. A lot of surfers make great swimmers because we do want to paddle wide. We're used to having that surfboard directly underneath our body, so we're engaging our lats by pulling nice and wide to the outside of that surfboard. And so that was a huge key for me. Remember to paddle wide. And so if you're paddling wide, you're not crossing that median. And so sometimes it's a good. It's a good little idea to put in your head, I have a surfboard underneath me. I need to paddle wide.

Vanessa Ronksley: That is a really great visual. And I feel like this is an area that so many swimmers struggle with, is coming too close to the median and crossing over. And. And you say to people, for example, when you're on deck, you're like, did you know that you are bringing your hands really close together? They're almost touching each other, and everyone's like, I'm not doing that. I swear. And then you show them the video, they're like, oh, yeah, okay, I am. So, like you said, those videos are super helpful to be able to show people, because most people think that they're doing the correct swimming technique, which is why they continue to swim that way. Let's head on to tip number two, Brandy, and this one's yours. So what do you. What do you have for us for tip number two?

Brandy Ramirez: So if you want to create a nice, strong pull with your hand in that catch phase, you want to engage your lats so weight training is always good. You can go to the gym, you could do some pull ups. The wider the pull up the better. There's the TRX systems and a lot of gyms which are the cables. Right. So you could do the cable RX swim, pull downs and just anything that's really going to engage that muscle group in the back so that you're engaging with the lats. A lot of yoga and I'm going to tell you a lot of yoga will do that. So if you're doing shavasana, just different poses in yoga, when you're on the ground, it's going to create that lat engagement. And so I would always tell you to do yoga as well. But weight training in the lats, you can never go wrong.

Vanessa Ronksley: And you know what, to be honest, like when you're in the gym and you're doing pull ups, don't you feel like you're just like this total machine? I just love doing pull ups and I want to be fully transparent here. Feel free to use a pull up assist. Like those things are magical and they make you look like a beast. So if you have not tried doing a pull up because you're afraid that you can't do one, just grab a couple of, you can just get those resistance bands, throw them over the top, like make a little knot at the top of the chin up bar, put your foot in there and then you can pull up all day long and it actually allows you to engage the appropriate muscles if you have a little bit of assistance. So get on that pull up bar, hammer them out, get the lats firing and then you'll notice your swim improve.

Michellie, what, what do you think about this lat engagement and, and encouraging a strong pull in the swim?

Michellie Jones: Yeah, it definitely sounds easy, that's for sure. When you know, you say, you know, just get in the gym and do it. And I, and I think that the, the biggest mistake people make because the pool is your engine, right? That's really where you know, you can grasp basically the most amount of water possible is during that pool phase. And I think a lot of people get confused what high elbow means because so much of the time it's like people think it's above the water. Yes. You have to have that nice like Pinocchio elbow that you are bringing your arm up. But then you also got to remember when you actually your hand goes in, you've got to then make sure your elbow is high then because that's going to create all this surface area and that underwater Strength so you can get that nice smooth finish right past your hips. And you know, this is where paddles if used wisely and making sure for me, you know, that paddle should be only slightly bigger than your hand.

Making sure you're using paddles for good technique and strength building rather than. I see so many people getting in and putting paddles on because they just want to swim faster because they say they're in a master's program and they just can't keep up. So they just put the paddles on. The nice thing with paddles, you know, it's. It's building strength. Slow down, put a snorkel on. You know, slow down, put a snorkel on, put those paddles on and make sure you are engaging the lats. Like Brandy says. I mean, straight away, sort of the paddles are like the truth serum. Like I'm the first thing I do, I take off the wrist strap because that's going to tell you if you're one, number one, placing your hand in the water correctly and then number two, making sure that you are pulling that water all the way past your hip. And I think that's the biggest thing with pull. Don't think of it as I want to do it because I want to try to keep up. Do it because you want to engage more lats that you want to work on your strength. And you also want to make sure that the paddle isn't too big for your hand. I think that's the biggest thing. You don't want it too small and you don't want it too big as well. That happy medium where it's slightly bigger than your hand. And the other thing that I love to doing is what's called reverse paddles. So it literally going to hold the paddle upside down if I can like show you my hand. So you're going to hold the paddle here and it's going to sit right on my forearm. So every time you swim, especially for that high elbow, it's going to give you sensory feedback straight away. Because if that paddle moves from your forearm, it means you've dropped the elbow. So sometimes we need a little bit of help. And I think that's another good thing. Getting that high elbow underneath the water is making sure that paddle never leaves your forearm by doing what we call a reverse paddle.

Vanessa Ronksley: Yeah, I think as well, like with that what you were just describing with the paddle on your forearm, just for people who couldn't see if you had the wrist strap on and you flipped it down so. So that it was Giving the surface area to your. To your forearm. That's what Michele was referring to there. And I do have another confession to make. I think I'm making a lot of confessions today. My swimming, I actually hate paddle work. And it makes me a lot slower than when I'm swimming normally. I don't know what it is, but that's okay.

Michellie Jones: But that's okay. The thing is, with paddles, it's like, are you going to swim faster if you're carrying weights now? No, it's. It's like a strength component, and I think that's where people get confused about paddles. That it is part you. You do have to have the strength. And that's why getting in the gym, doing the lat work is important as well, because you've got to be able to do the stream. But it's okay that you're slowing down, because one thing that happens is your heart rate's going to drop, right? Your heart rate will drop. So then you can actually swim a little bit longer, say, in a session, because your heart rate, like, if you're tired, like you put your paddles on, you can still swim your zones, like the pace on the zones, but your heart rate will be a little bit lower. And it's just like, you know when you're doing, like, the big gear stuff on the bike, right? When you put it into a lower cadence, right? Everything, you're going to be slower, right. But you're pushing more power. Right? And that's the same with paddles. So, like, embrace the paddles. They're not meant to be faster in the session. They're meant so that you're working on good technique and that you are working on some strength. And as I said, they are a truth serum, because right then you just told me exactly what you need to do. The one thing that you hate doing is what you should do more.

Vanessa Ronksley: Right. I've heard that multiple times before. Thank you for that. So now I'm excited to get into the pool because I have two tips under my belt of them has put the paddles on. Brandy, what. What do you have to add here on paddle work?

Brandy Ramirez: Yeah. Another great indication of whether or not you have good form when you're using your paddles is if your shoulders start to burn, you are not pulling with your lats unless you're doing the butterfly. You should not be feeling any kind of burn or anything in your shoulders. And so if you do still start to feel that burn in the shoulders, you really need to try to push to a 45 angle at your shoulders and your hips. And so it's just a good note. If you're in the water and your shoulders start to get achy or start to burn, you're not pulling from your lats. Make sure you start focusing on that angle.

Vanessa Ronksley: I think that is a massive. That could be its own tip right there. We have tip 2A. Because a lot of people do struggle with shoulder pain when they're swimming and that is not supposed to happen just so that everyone out there knows, like, you're not supposed to have shoulder pain while swimming. And, and it's just like Brandy said, it's. We need to activate those lats. And sometimes I find getting athletes to, to push themselves up on the side of the pool and just really engage those lats. Like, if they're having shoulder pain, it's like, okay, let's just go to the side of the pool and push your. Push yourself out. It's. Did your shoulders hurt? No. Okay, well, that's the same muscle group that you're trying to activate when you are swimming. So let's see if we can find that same. That same type of activation when we're, you know, not pushing up but pushing forward in the water. I think that, yeah, this is, this is great. These are awesome tips so far. Thank you to our fabulous coaches. Let's go to tip number three, and Brandy is going to deliver this one. So what do you have for our listeners?

Brandy Ramirez: You need to focus on breathing on both sides, right? A lot of people are only happy breathing on the right or only happy breathing on the left. So I would really encourage you to learn to breathe to both sides. If you're only breathing to one side, you are creating a muscular imbalance within the body. You're only developing muscles on one side of the neck. And so a good way to learn how to breathe on both sides is to use fins because it's going to give you a bit of space speed. It's going to help you get a little faster in the water and really just try to hold a 45 degree body position and just breathe to one side, that one side that you don't like. So now you could be a little bit slower. You could be a little more methodical on rotating the head, the chin so that you can breathe to the side that you're not comfortable on. You have to put the time in, you have to train the body to breathe to both sides.

Vanessa Ronksley: I think this is really valuable for, for every swimmer. And, and let's just stop here for a second and talk about how magical fins are, because they take out that. That extra. They take out, you know, one of the factors that causes people to have struggles swimming and that is the body position. And so when you put those fins on, it's like you have one less thing to think about as you are swimming. And for breathing in particular. I know I work with a lot of beginner swimmers, and they really struggle with the breathing aspect of swimming because this is the only place in the entire world where you're restricted as to when you can actually breathe in and out. And so it creates a lot of anxiety for people. And so when you're telling them to do something that feels uncomfortable in the first place, and then they have to breathe to a side that they're not wanting to breathe to, then slap those fins on and learn that. Because, man, when you go out into the open water, if you have the sun or you have a wild swimmer next to you that on the side that you usually breathe on, or if the waves are coming at you, you also need to be able to breathe on that other side, just in case. Michellie, what. What do you think about breathing on both sides? Do you. Do you do this in your own swim practice?

Michellie Jones: Yeah, I do it. I. I've done it, like, my whole career, and one of the reasons why I did it from the start, it's going to make you swim. So. And it also gives you that ability that, you know, if you do get in that situation where there's somebody who's kicking maybe water in your face on your dominant breathing side, or there's a big chop and you've got to breathe on the other side. You know, it's. It's a really important technique to develop, and it does take time, but, you know, everything takes time. You know, if you don't practice it, you'll never learn it. And it's like, for me, it's like when I'm working with an athlete, I sort of say to them, let's go back to, like, what your regular breathing pattern is. And in one lap, I want you to at least breathe one side on the other side, just because sometimes it can get a little complicated for them because they're so secure on one side. And it's like, I feel like if you just break it down even more and then, yes, flippers, everything, you get time right, Everything's slowing down because of the give you in that kick. It gives you time to think. And that's why flippers are so good, because especially when you're doing drills, which I highly recommend for most drills. I put all my athletes in flippers because it gives you time to think.

Vanessa Ronksley: Yes. I love my fins, and I. I like the longer ones, actually. I used to. Prior to pool school, I swam with the shorter fins because I thought it was harder. But then I didn't realize what the purpose of the fins actually were.

Michellie Jones: Exactly. Exactly. Yes. Yes. Yeah.

Vanessa Ronksley: Yep. So I've. I've switched to the longer fins and. And I love them. And I. If now it's like I have to remove them because I love them so much. I want to swim with them all the time. They're like my best friend in the pool. But that. That's okay. So we're working on getting rid of using the fins.

Michellie Jones: All the time and then using your paddles more, Vanessa, using your paddles more.

Vanessa Ronksley: Okay, paddles more, fins less. Got it. I actually need to get my swim in today, so maybe that will be the. My mantra as I go to the pool. Let's head to tip number four. And Brandy, we're coming to you again for our fourth tip of the day.

Brandy Ramirez: Yeah. So a lot of us are busy. A lot of us have so many things going on in our days. We travel. A great way to stay. Stay in swim shape is to find a workaround. Right. So if you have cables, they fit so nicely into your luggage or to your carry on, and you can get a swim exercise done in your hotel room with your cords. Or you could bring swim bands as well, and you can use them in any hotel environment. And then again, I'm going to toss out there yoga, do some chaturangas in your hotel, because that is just nothing but lat works. So you could do it. It is not a. It's not a pushup. A chaturanga is completely different from a regular pushup because you are engaging the lats and holding yourself just a couple inches off of the ground. Right. You're hovering right there. So you're engaging those lats so much, getting that nice burn. And then if you could push up into baby Cobra. It's almost that same movement with the arm right where you're coming down and you're finishing at the thigh, right. With your. Your thumb to thigh and palm up to the sky. So definitely these are workarounds. You could do them anywhere, but you have to be consistent and you have to find the time and put the work in.

Michellie Jones: Yeah.

Vanessa Ronksley: Coach Michellie, what are your thoughts on swim tubing and incorporating that into the weekly routine?

Michellie Jones: I do It a couple of times a week. Sometimes I'll do it as my pre warmup for a strength session and sometimes it's my pre warmup on the pool deck. Yeah, I'm a big believer in shoulder health. And not only that, it's like swim cords bands. You can get surgical tubing and tie little like knots at the end so you have two loops. But the reason why you want to do it is muscle memory is everything. So you can actually practice that dry land before you get in the pool. Like your techniques. So you can work on your catch, you can work on your lats a little bit by doing some all sorts of stuff. Like I have like a little chest press that I do that I bring the cords out and then bring them back and really squeeze my shoulders together to try to like loosen it up. But yeah, they're so important because like, if you can't do a good catch with swim cords, it's going to be very difficult to do when you're in the water. And you know, it is a great way to warm up before races. Like a lot of the times we don't get in the water to warm up, we're not allowed. So a swim cord workout can be five to 10 minutes. You know, it's a great way to do your shoulder health, practice technique and warm up before a swim. Like, you will feel so much better. I prefer my athlete span, five minutes on the pool deck, doing some activation and some technique work then and have five minutes less in the pool. Because I think it, as I said, like I love to say, what gives you the biggest bang for the buck and swim cords. You can do it anywhere. It's efficient and it's very technique driven if you want it to be. And it's also, you know, if you do have tight shoulders or you know, you have an issue, you know, working on that shoulder health is so important because you know, you don't want to have those issues when you swim because usually it means like your swim technique is an issue. Like Brandy said, you're not engaging the lats. Are you getting that shoulder pain? So anytime that you can do something that's very simple, easy, and you can do it anywhere, anytime. I'm 100% for.

Vanessa Ronksley: And you know what, with this, there, there are zero excuses to getting this part of your swimming done right.

Michellie Jones: The dry land training, lots of excuses. I'll be on deck and I'm there doing my stuff and my athletes are watching me and I'm like, you know, you've got to set A good example. And I'm like, why are you watching me? This is on your program. Why aren't you doing it?

Vanessa Ronksley: So Michellie has her swim tubing with her, like, pretty much in her pocket. So there are no excuses to getting that done because you, you bring it with you wherever you go, and it doesn't take very much time. Like, it's legitimately spend a few minutes here or there doing this. And one of the things that I feel is really important about swim tubing is something that we were talking about earlier with one of our tips was, was pulling really wide. And if you're doing swim tubing, there's no way that you can have your arms, you know, closer to the midline and have an effective pull with that swim tubing. So that muscle, you have to stay on the rails. Stay on your rails, Exactly. You've got your train tracks. And. And in order for you to actually perform that movement, you're creating the. The appropriate position for your hands, because otherwise you're going to hit your body. So it's one of those things that is, it's working all aspects. It's got strength, it's got the technique in there, and it's helping you to make sure that your arms are in the right position. So I think swim tubing is the best. And if you can't get to the pool because of some excuse that you've made up or because of your traveling or whatever is happening in your life and the pool is just not an option that day, then there is zero excuse for you to miss a swim tubing set. So we're gonna just stick it. Stick right there with that one. Let's go to tip number five. And Michellie, we're gonna come to you first for this one.

Michellie Jones: You have to practice open water, and there's no excuses for it because you don't need open water to practice open water. Yes, getting into open water is great, but not everyone has that opportunity. So when you're in the pool, you know, you can practice siding. You can practice swimming in a straight line. Like, I have my athletes, like, close your eyes for like 10 strokes, not the whole length of the pool because I don't want you to hit the wall. But, you know, and, and see, did I swim straight? And, you know, even practicing siding, like, I'll stand at the end of the pool and I'll hold like, something up. It might be like two fingers, it might be a kickboard, it might be that I'm on the other side of the pool. And they have to look for me because sometimes, you know, the, The. The buoys move when you're swimming, so, you know, you can practice that and, you know, drafting, too. Practice drafting. A lot of the times where I swim, we do a train where you got to swap off every, like, 50 or 100 yards. Meters, yards, whatever you're swimming. I mean, it's good. And, you know, sometimes I'll line like three, three or four swimmers up in one lane. So they're getting used to how sometimes, you know, there's a little chaos at the start. So you get used to, like, you know, just like on the bike, right? You've got to learn to hold your line so that you're not interfering with other people. And it's the same with swimming. You've got to learn to hold your line and swim in that chaos sometimes. And, you know, that confidence that you get. The other thing that I like to do is have my athletes do dolphin dives in the pool where you've got to dive down, touch the. The bottom, and then come back up, dive down, come back up. Because if you've got surf entry, you know, it's a good way to learn breath control, for one, because getting through the surf is having the confidence that, you know, you've got to hold the sand, come back up behind the wave, and then go under again when they're next wave. So getting confident of diving down, touching the bottom, and coming back up is really, really important. And, you know, as I said, you know, you don't practice this the day before. You can practice this in the pool. And I actually have some fun sessions where we'll actually, like, start in the middle of the pool. So we practice some deep water starts as well. There's so much stuff that you can mimic. Obviously, there's sometimes more fear in open water, so definitely, it's always nice to get that opportunity. But if you don't practice it in the pool.

Vanessa Ronksley: Yes, I 100% agree with you on that. And. And I know that for me, one of the most glorious things in the whole world is walking into the pool and seeing nobody else there. And you get your own lane, and it's so relaxing and calming. But then you have to remind yourself, in what race situation am I the only person in the pool? And so sometimes, even though it's highly uncomfortable and I don't like doing it, but as you said, you have to do the things you don't like to do. Hop into the.

Michellie Jones: You need to come, Vanessa. You need to come and swim with Me, where I've been swimming, there's no lane lines. There's no lane lines. There's a lot of breaststroke going on. And it's like. I'm usually like, I've been swimming here for the last 45 minutes. It's like, why are suddenly you in my space? It's like, yeah, it's like crazy. But, yeah, you. Sometimes you. You know, as much as you want to control your environment, it's like, in the last couple of weeks, I've had absolutely no control, and it's every person for themselves. And, like. And I love Germany, and that's where I am. And it's like, oh, my goodness. You have these awesome autobahns and you all know how to drive, but none of you know how to swim in a crowded pool.

Vanessa Ronksley: Okay, that is just mind blowing. There's no rhyme or reason I can't understand. So I. I'm German. Like, my family heritage is German, and I am fully aware that everything has its place and it's very orderly. And you do, like, you put every.

Michellie Jones: Because I'm doing freestyle. Yeah.

Vanessa Ronksley: Well, it just blows my mind that you're in Germany, that there's no lane ropes and that there's no order to. Maybe. Maybe that's where they let loose, the Germans is in the pool.

Michellie Jones: They were very impressed. Where I've been swimming. One of the pools I've been swimming is only 13 meshes.

Vanessa Ronksley: Oh, yeah.

Michellie Jones: It's. It's probably up to my knees in one end. They're surprised that I can still do a tumble turn in that shallow water. They actually came up to me. One of the lifeguards came up to me and goes, oh, my goodness. That takes a lot of talent.

Vanessa Ronksley: Oh, yeah. Well, you're the right person for the job, that's for sure. Brandy, what do you have to add here about mastery of open water in use or utilizing the pool?

Brandy Ramirez: Yeah, I think those are great tips, Michellie, and I absolutely love that story. And. And definitely I agree with Michellie. If you're in a pool, there's been plenty of situations, I'm sure, where you're in a pool and somebody next to you is creating these waves. And most people will just kind of slow down for a little bit. They kick back, they let that person go. And you shouldn't. You should actually adapt to that position. Right. Learn to. To get through that position, to get through the breathing. How many times have you been in a pool and somebody splashes water directly into your mo. It don't instantly want to panic and pop up and try to spit it out instead. Control the mind, control the situation, and you take the water, spit it out, and then continue on breathing. It's going to happen on race day. I mean, let's be real. It's going to happen on race day. So the more you can control it, the better. But one thing that I would really want people to do is practice in their wetsuit. Do not wait until race day to put that wetsuit on and to try to get a wetsuit. So swim in, go out to open water. I've had so many athletes put their wetsuit on and jump in their pool. Most pools are heated to like 72 to 82 degrees, right? And they're in there and then they're like, it was so hot. I don't want to wear my wetsuit on race day. Well, that's not going to be race day. So make sure that you take the time to get in your wetsuit and get out in some kind of open water to experience that. You really need to train the mind to not react in a panic mode so that when race day comes, you are much more calm and you are in control of yourself.

Vanessa Ronksley: And, you know, not only the, the practicing in the wetsuit, but I find one of the biggest differences between open water and pool for many of the locations that athletes are going to be racing is the visibility. And, and you don't want that to be a shock the first time you step into that open water and, and you can't see anything except for maybe a few weeds, but, or you know, like little floaty things that are right near your face. But, but swimming in open water, one of the things that we deal with is there's nothing to look at. Like you have no reference. And so again, we have to rely on that appropriate body position and, and remembering, like to look down so that our feet don't drop. You know, as we had mentioned in, in tip number one, with body position, when you don't have that black line as a frame of reference or the lane ropes to the side, we might, we might start to develop some kind of a, something in our swim swim that might affect how quickly we are going through, in that, in, in that time. So I think, yeah, getting into the open water is definitely something that we need to do. And, and I, I mean, I live in landlocked Alberta here in Canada. There is no water to swim speak of. And it's going to be frozen until, you know, June or something like that, at which point it'll be freezing Cold. But you've got to make an effort to get out in that open water to experience all aspects of it. The, the lack of lines, the lack of, you know, visibility and the, the temperature for sure. And then making sure that wetsuit fits and that you're comfortable utilizing it, I think is super important.

Michellie Jones: I think that's a good point that not everyone has an opportunity to swim in open water. So before a race, yeah, definitely get in and practice that, you know, splashing your face with cold water, putting some warm water down your wetsuit or just like regular water because it will start heat and then it heats up and then that creates a warmth barrier as well. And I think that's the big, the most important thing when you are doing a race in cold water is making sure that you have practiced some sort of adaption. And maybe it is you got to swim in cold water, maybe you didn't, but that's okay. The day before, you can still acclimatize. And definitely the morning of the race, just splashing your face with water, putting some water down your suit, all those sort of things can help you adapt. It's amazing how quickly the human body is adaptable. And that little bit of confidence and knowing how to handle, like as Brandy said, you know, you've got to get comfortable and you've got to like. I always like have a mantra like for my athletes who like struggle a little bit in the water, like, stop, breathe, take your time. And I think that's the biggest mistake that a lot of athletes will make is because, you know, when you get into that cold water, you know, you can hyperventilate where, you know, you feel like you're not breathing. So it's like, it's really important to like have some key words that you can grasp. I know I used to have this one coach would basically said, when that happens, just grab that monkey and throw him off your back. You know, that was like a physical thing that he would tell his athletes to do. So sometimes, you know, that mental strategy and then sort of something physical like physically going, okay, get off my back. I'm going to get through this. And you know, it's just taking your time and developing that skill set that you need to get through those challenging swims because let's face it, a lot of people are intimidated by the water.

Brandy Ramirez: Absolutely. I couldn't agree with you more, Michele. And another great thing that I tell athletes, and especially first time athletes getting in that water, as they enter the water, I want you to take a deep breath. But as the face enters, I want you to completely just exhale all of that. So that one, you're not a lot of people when they get in, they go, right and they suck in. And now they're panicking and they hold that for the first couple seconds in the water and do the opposite. Really empty the lungs. Like completely exhale. As soon as the face goes into the water, it's going to bring your heart rate down. It's going to help you not panic and hyperventilate.

Michellie Jones: Yeah. And that's where that, like that Navy SEAL breathing can come in too. Where, you know, you, you take that time in to count your breaths down. So it's like 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and then let it out. Yeah. So like any, anything that you can do to get into that comfort zone, it does take practice. And yeah, I think we've given some really good tips on how to handle that.

Vanessa Ronksley: Absolutely. I think you two are on fire. I don't even need to really be here. You can just keep going with all the tips that you have. It's been really great. And we have come to our final tip, which is tip big time swim tip for triathletes. This is number six and we're going to go to Michellie first here to deliver. Deliver the goodness.

Michellie Jones: Yes. Our favorite thing, consistent consistency. Right? That's, that's the secret to getting better consistency. Like everyone's like Michellie, how do I get better? There's no shortcuts. You have to be consistent. But don't just get through your swim. You know, you want to have some structure. Like I've had athletes like, yeah, I just get in and I just swim for a certain amount of time. Like, just like the bike, just like the run. Swimming needs to have some structure. You know, a good warm up, some good drills, a preset, a main set, a cool down. And you know, there's a reason why we have all these toys like paddles like we discussed. You know, don't use them for the wrong reason. Use them for the right reason. You know, a pool boy has purpose. Don't get stuck to it. Just like Vanessa said she got stuck to flippers. Flippers have a purpose. Yes, you can use them, but they have purpose. So you want to have intention. And it's not just intention for the workout. Whether it's a threshold session, aerobic session, or just a drill, technique based session, you know, everything should have intention. Just like every other part of your training program. Even when you get in the open water, I tell my Athletes don't just get in and swim. Have intention. Maybe it's like 10 minutes easy, and then it's 50 strokes hard, 50 strokes easy, 50 strokes moderate, 50 strokes easy. Whatever it is, have purpose.

Like, I will even have my athletes, like, if we're swimming laps, we'll do a lap and then we'll get out, we'll grab some toys, and then we'll do another lap. But every lap has purpose. It's not just go in and swim and la de da da. Like, I used to have a run coach that I work with and he would always say, oh my goodness, swimming is so easy, it's so relaxing. And I'm like, I don't know what type of swimming you're doing. And I was listening to a Podcast the other day and a professional athlete was saying, like, yes, you need technique, but you also need to build your engine. And I think that's what people sometimes forget. Like, but the thing, the tricky thing with swimming, fast swimming should feel easy. And it's so hard to comprehend as triathletes because we all think that if we go hard, we will get better. But swimming is not like that. So you've got to have structure, you got to have intention and use your toys appropriately.

Vanessa Ronksley: You know, I just like everyone who's listening to just stop what they're doing. Unless you're driving, obviously keep your hands on the wheel. But one of the things that I'm pretty sure every adult onset swimmer can attest to if they've transitioned to triathlon is the first time you get in the pool and you're like, I'm going to do a triathlon. And you legitimately just look at the distance that the triathlon is for the swim portion. And that's how far you swim without stopping, without doing a warmup. Like, I am positive that so many people out there do that. And I did it. I'm raising my hand. I'm being honest. The first time I got in the pool after not having swum since I was a child, I was like, oh, well, my swim for my try is 500 meters. So I'm just going to go and swim 500 meters and see how it feels. And I went obviously as fast as I could because that's just how I roll. And it didn't feel so good. The, you know, like, technique was very poor. So I think that that's really important that we know that this is still something that needs to have that intention and that purpose. And yeah, I think that's important. So, Brandy, what do you have to say about consistency? I know we talk about consistency every single episode that we do on this show, but how does it relate to our secret?

Michellie Jones: It's the secret.

Vanessa Ronksley: Yeah. Right.

Brandy Ramirez: Yeah. I first have to point out that I love whenever I get to speak to Michele because of her accent, and when she said pool buoy, I swear she said pool boy. That he was important. I always love hearing her what country?

Michellie Jones: I mean, I sometimes I forget how to be like, we're supposed to say it in one country, we say it one way in another country. And I'm like.

Brandy Ramirez: What happens when you get to travel so much? Michele, jealous? Yeah.

Vanessa Ronksley: No.

Brandy Ramirez: So for me, yeah, consistency is key. If you expect to have gains on any aspect of your life, you have to put the time in, you have to work for it. And so consistency is such key. Get in the pool, do the work. Like Michellie said, make sure that you're swimming with intention and purpose. And also make sure you're setting yourself up for success. And for me, that means scheduling the time to go to the pool, not just for the one hour. I'm going to the pool because I have to get dressed, I have to shower, I have to do my hair. I have to do all of these things. So set yourself up for success and schedule it into your diary or your day, Right? So it's not just going to be a one hour at the pool. It's probably going to be a 1 hour, 45 minutes, depending on who you are and how long it takes you. So make sure that you're blocking out enough time to be successful. So you're not trying to rush through your training. You're not trying to cut your swim short because you didn't realize you have a meeting and you're not going to be able to make it in time. Be consistent, do the work, schedule yourself. Right? Set yourself up for success. And definitely always do it with the intention of getting stronger, better, faster by swimming with purpose.

Announcer: Great set, everyone. Let's cool down.

Cool Down

Vanessa Ronksley: Welcome to the cool down, everybody. I am going to carry right on from our main set right into the cool down. And I'm super excited to have Coach Michellie on the cooldown for the first time with me. Anyways, maybe you've been on with Andrew before, but this is my first time with you, and I just. I just love you. You're the best. And so I'm. I'm wondering if you will be able to share one final triathlon training, racing, or lifestyle tip with our listeners today.

Michellie Jones: Fun. You know, make sure you put the f u n in everything you do. And it's so important because, like, I wouldn't be doing triathlon for as long as I have been doing it if there wasn't some fun component. And sometimes that fun is like after you finish something, sometimes it's drawing, sometimes it doesn't happen till you do the reflection. But yeah, it's like it's, you know, it is finding your why, but it's also finding your fun because that fun is going to keep you going. And it could be as easy as, I loved going to swimming because I get to work on my technique, or I love going running because I'm going to go run with some friends, or I love to go biking because I'm going to explore all these new things that, you know, I never get to do. I always tell people, like when I go to a race in a different country or a different city, it's such a different perspective than a regular tourist gets to see. I mean, we get that community sport support. We get to see like such a different part of a city or a town. So, yeah, I think that's the most important in anything you do is, is have fun.

Announcer: Thanks for joining us. Make sure to subscribe and share the TriDot Podcast with your triathlon crew for more great tri content and community. Connect with us on Facebook, YouTube and Instagram. Ready to optimize your training? Head to TriDot.com and start your free trial today. TriDot, the obvious and automatic choice for triathlon training.

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